Bob Kauflin: We sing, not because we have a great voice, not because we’re professional singers, not because someone tells us to but because Jesus Christ has given us a song to sing.
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David Zimmer: Welcome to Sound Plus Doctrine, the podcast of Sovereign Grace Music. Where we explore what the Bible has to say about music and worship in the church. And encourage those who plan, lead and participate in their Sunday gatherings each week.
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DZ: Hello and welcome to the Sound Plus Doctrine podcast. My name is David Zimmer.
BK: My name is Bob Kauflin.
DZ: It is great to be together.
BK: Always a joy to be together.
[chuckle]
DZ: We have a…
BK: Wouldn’t it be bad if one time I said, you know what? It’s really not, it’s really not good being together. [chuckle] I’m sorry, David, I’ve been wanting to tell you, I just thought I’d tell you right now on the podcast.
DZ: That would be embarrassing and…
BK: But I’m not gonna say that, because it is a joy to be together.
DZ: Perfect.
BK: Okay.
DZ: Well, we have so much to cover on today’s episode and that’s why, if you can’t tell, we’re really excited. It’s because of that reason. And the reason that is, is we are talking today about 15 reasons why my congregation isn’t singing.
BK: Oh my gosh.
DZ: So we have a lot to cover.
BK: There is a lot to cover.
DZ: In one episode.
BK: Yep.
DZ: So we’re gonna jump right in.
BK: But we’re professionals, so this should not be a problem.
[chuckle]
DZ: It’s not true.
BK: Okay. Number one. Well, let’s set this up a little bit. I think this is probably one of the questions I get asked most often, right after the most… The question I get asked most often is, “What do you do about singing songs from questionable sources?” That’s, without a doubt, the number one question, which we will address on a future episode of this podcast but not today.
DZ: Yes.
BK: Second question is, “Hey, how do I get my congregation to sing better?” It’s odd, there are churches throughout the world. They gather every Sunday, every Sunday and one of the things we’re called to do is to sing, sing to the Lord a new song. The Psalms are filled with exhortations to sing. Colossians 3:16, it says, we’re to sing psalms, hymns, spiritual songs, with thankfulness in our hearts to God. Ephesians 5, talks about singing, addressing one another in Psalms, hymns and spiritual songs where it says sing together. And yet they’re saying my congregation’s not singing, and it’s good to know why.
DZ: Yeah.
BK: Why isn’t your congregation singing? So that’s why we’re doing this podcast. 15 reasons why my congregation isn’t singing.
DZ: Yes.
BK: So I got a list here. Feel free to jump in on any of these.
DZ: Yeah.
BK: I think… And these aren’t in any particular order. Okay? So first, it’s just wrong range. I think the ideal range for congregational song is an A to a D. An octave and a fourth. Now that can be stretched, certainly can be smaller, a song, like “Come Behold the Wondrous Mystery” is just a sixth. It’s the range of a sixth.
DZ: Yeah.
BK: “In Christ Alone” is the range of an octave and a fourth, “Before The throne of God Above” actually is an octave and a fifth for one note, [chuckle] but within that A to D most…
DZ: You’re not staying up there.
BK: You’re not staying up there. And we’ll talk about that in the next point.
DZ: Yeah.
BK: But it’s just hitting the wrong range. And a problem is a lot of modern worship songs today are wide ranges. I remember listening to one song. It was the range was an octave and a seventh, almost two octaves. I thought, “Man, your congregation might sing that if like really young and really excited.” But your typical multi-generational congregation and that’s what we’re talking about.
DZ: Yeah.
BK: And it should be stated that we’re thinking of just a normal church.
DZ: Yeah.
BK: Where people from different ages, different generations, let’s see, I guess that’s the same thing. Different, maybe backgrounds, why they’re not singing. And one of the main reasons is just the range is too broad. So that’d be the first thing.
DZ: Yeah. Well, and you said, in terms of range, the other point is the tessitura of the range.
BK: Point number two. Yeah.
DZ: Yeah.
BK: Tessitura.
DZ: Right. We’ve talked about that on a previous podcast.
BK: Okay. I remember.
DZ: But if you haven’t listened to a previous podcast of us talking about that…
BK: You should go back and listen to all of them.
DZ: You should, but also, can you just define what tessitura is.
BK: Define that? Yeah. So tessitura is where the song hangs out.
DZ: Yeah.
BK: Where most of it lies.
DZ: Yeah. So you said on, “In Christ Alone” or in Come Behold, it hits that note and then comes off…
BK: Well no, that’s Before the Throne.
DZ: Before the throne.
BK: It’s in… Before the Throne.
[vocalization]
BK: So it’s just one note.
[vocalization]
BK: But the tessitura is kind of on the downside.
[vocalization]
DZ: Yeah, so it’s staying low.
[vocalization]
BK: That’s the first half of the song is kinda low.
[vocalization]
BK: So that’s lower. So it’s kind of in the middle.
DZ: Yeah.
BK: But you could look at your song and if you can’t do this, if you don’t know the theory to do this, ask someone who does.
DZ: Yeah.
BK: Say, “Kate, where does this song lie?” Now some songs, again, especially modern songs are written in this low, high, dynamic. And that’s the octave jump is the essence of that where you sing a lot of songs down here. Then you sing a lot…
DZ: Yes. The Octave jump.
BK: Then you sing a lot… Then you sing a lot of songs up here or even you sing a lot of songs up here. And it’s hard, it’s hard to lead those kind of songs.
[laughter]
DZ: Just imagine someone driving in their car on their way to work at 6:45. And hear you singing so high.
BK: Well, welcome to the day.
[laughter]
BK: Yeah, so yeah, if the tessitura is bad, so you do a song… You don’t choose a song based on if you sound good on it.
DZ: Yeah. Good.
BK: Please don’t do that. It’s not wise. Some leaders say, “Well, I just don’t sound good up there,” or some will say, “I don’t sound good down there.” Choose songs with good ranges, good tessituras that your whole congregation can sing and that you can sing.
DZ: Yeah.
BK: And don’t pitch the song just because you can hit it. And a lot of the songs that are recorded by popular ministries, bands, churches, they have great singers.
DZ: Yeah.
BK: You might not be a great singer.
DZ: Yeah.
BK: And I can assure you that everyone in your congregation is not a great singer. [laughter] So pick a good range.
DZ: Especially that is a hard thing for tenors because like myself I have a very high voice.
BK: Yes, and we’re always battling this when…
DZ: Yeah.
BK: Well, it’s not a real battle, but…
DZ: We’re duking it out.
BK: I know that a song was… You’ll feel better, will sound better for you, like say in D, that might go up to a D or an E even, and you say, “Yeah, this is my peak range.” [laughter] But the ladies and a lot of the guys are saying, “I can barely hit that.”
DZ: Yeah, yeah, and it’ll be hard to stay up there.
BK: Yes, for sure, for sure. And again, talking about tessitura, In Christ Alone is a great example of a song that has a low tessitura.
[vocalization]
BK: Same thing.
[vocalization]
DZ: Repetitive too, yeah.
[vocalization]
BK: Just at one spot where you go high. So you can tend to move that song up a little, we actually do that song in a D and modulate to E. So at one point…
DZ: It’s a stretch but just for a second.
BK: You hit an E just for a second.
DZ: Yeah.
BK: And that can have a real dramatic effect ’cause you’re at the very top of your voice, you’re hitting those, saying those words and emphasizing them in that way.
DZ: Yes.
BK: So wrong range, wrong tessitura. Third reason your congregation might not be singing is just singability. I think a lot of the songs coming out today are creative, a joy to listen to, joy even to sing once you know them. But if you don’t know them, it can be really challenging to latch on to it.
DZ: Yeah.
BK: Songs with a lot of syncopation and not just syncopation but waits. Where you have a certain repeated pattern, and then you change it, and then you change it again, and it’s like, “Oh man.” I’ve been in congregations or at least events where I’m trying to sing those kind of songs and it’s just hard. Now, if your congregation knows the song, then sure.
DZ: It’s different. Yeah. I think with Sovereign Grace Music, we have a blend of contemporary rhythms and melodies, and then we also have a lot of hymn-ish songs that have three verses and a lot of repetition, and I like that we have both of those things. I think… Could you talk about, maybe there is a song that has a difficult motif, rhythm motif to sing, but you’ve taught it to your congregation and you haven’t just done that song and then moved on, and you’re never gonna do it again.
BK: Yeah.
DZ: Can you talk about how do you teach that just briefly, how do you teach a song that you really want your congregation to sing because of what it says, and it’s theology and how it could serve them, but they need to learn it?
BK: Yeah, that’s a great question. Sometimes a recording has different melodies from verse to verse, the person who’s singing it will sing a different melody from verse to verse, so in that case, I’ll modify the melody and sing the same thing each time, perhaps. Some congregations I know will smooth out some of the syncopations. They’ve done that with our songs, that’s totally fine. If your church is used to singing hymns, and you’re trying to sing a modern song and there’s lots of syncopation, they’re gonna have trouble.
DZ: Yeah.
BK: So it’s okay, smooth it out a little bit.
DZ: Yeah, yeah, that’s a good point.
BK: That’s right, try and make it consistent. You could do it for the people and say, “Hey, we want you to listen to this,” put it on a Spotify playlist, put it on a iTunes playlist.
DZ: Get to them before.
BK: Yes, get to them before. And just get them to listen to it, ’cause that’s how kids learn music. We learn by ear. We don’t read notes, we learn by ear, and kids can learn a lot of songs by ear. They can learn very complicated songs by ear. So you can use that for your congregation and just say, “Hey here, why don’t you listen to this song before we do it on Sunday?”
DZ: That’s great.
BK: And those are some of the ways. Do it for them, without them singing, say, “We’re gonna do this. Listen, then you can join in.”
DZ: Yep.
BK: It can be challenging, especially when a church is used to very straight on the beat kind of melodies to do something that’s more… Yeah, more…
DZ: Rhythmically complicated. Yeah.
BK: Yes. Rhythmically complicated.
DZ: I love all those. I think those are all helpful tips for worship leaders as you’re planning to allow these songs to be singable…
BK: And by the way, I don’t think Sovereign Grace Music has done particularly great in this respect over the years, we’re trying to do better, we’re trying to write songs that are more singable.
DZ: Yeah.
BK: I listen to some of the songs we did two, three decades ago, and I just… In fact, I’ll sometimes be in a situation where I’m being led by someone and they’ll do an old Sovereign Grace song, and I won’t recognize it, and I’ll think, “Where did that song come from? This is so hard to sing.” And then I realize it’s one of ours. [laughter] Which is sad, but…
DZ: That’s great.
BK: We’re trying to do better. We’re taking baby steps, so we’re trying to do better.
DZ: Yes. Good.
BK: But it is worth looking for songs that are easy to latch on to, easy to sing.
DZ: That’s good.
BK: So that’s point number three, singability. Number four too much content.
DZ: Can you have too much content?
BK: Can you have too much content? Can someone in the Sovereign Grace podcast, Sound Plus Doctrine podcast be saying you can have too much content? Yes. Yes, you can.
DZ: Yes.
BK: Bryan Chapell in his book, Christ-Centered Worship, talks about a congregation’s capacities. How much can a congregation actually take in? And I think of it like our brains or our souls, our hearts are like these five gallon containers and we’re trying to pour like 50 gallon, 100 gallon truths into them. And it’s just like brrr brrr brrr, we just load it in, load it in and load. And people get tired. And they just stop singing. This is… I can’t take all this in. So there can be too much content where there’s just words, words, words. Everything’s four verses, everything’s really deep and solid and it’s like, there’s no time to breathe a little bit and just think about this. The Psalms have that kind of variety where you have ones that are very intense, very deep, very full of content. Psalm 145 would be a great example of that, where it just talks about the Lord is gracious and merciful.
BK: This is Verse 8, slow to anger, abounding in steadfast love, the Lord is good to all. His mercy is over all that he has made. And then later on, the Lord upholds all who are falling, raises up all who are bowed down, the eyes of all look to you and you give them their food in due season, you open your hand, you satisfy the desire of every living thing. The Lord is righteous in all his ways. It’s just brr brrr brrr brrr, so we did a song. We wrote a song based on the Psalm, on “Unchanging God”, “How Great”. And one of the challenges was not making it sound like brrr brrr, just pounding you with truth and truth. Just giving you some time to say, great is the Lord and greatly to be praised and his greatness is unsearchable. So yeah. You can have too much content in your songs.
DZ: Yeah. When you talk about that, taking a deep breath, you’re talking about responding.
BK: Yes, yes.
DZ: Right?
BK: Yes. Not just kind of checking out.
DZ: Yeah. So you would maybe put in… You would maybe split that up just so people aren’t confused. If you had a song that had a lot of content, like you’re saying, a lot of the hymns, how would you split that up and allow people to take a breath?
BK: Yeah, that’s great. There are a variety of ways. You could, one look for songs that have that variety. So it’s one of the reasons we add choruses to hymns. A lot of content, the chorus gives you a little chance to breathe and reflect.
DZ: That’s the best argument I’ve heard for adding a chorus to a hymn.
BK: I think it is the main reason other than to add the gospel to it. But yeah, give people just this… It should be relevant to the hymn. I’ve heard choruses added to hymns that are just like… That just… That’s nothing. So it’s relevant to the hymn. You could do simpler songs in between two hymns. The other thing is you can train your church over time to expand their capacity. And I think you should seek to do that. We shouldn’t sing the same simple choruses, there’s a reason, the choruses that were so popular in the ’70s aren’t being sung a ton today. Maybe they are in some churches, but I’d say those churches could benefit from exploring both what has been written in the past.
DZ: Exactly.
BK: And what has been written in the last 20, 30 years because there’s a lot of great songs that… There are a lot of great songs that have been written that could serve the church that go beyond just the simple choruses that were so popular in the ’70s.
DZ: That’s reason number five. Too little content.
BK: Okay. Too little content. Okay, great. Let’s move right along. Yeah, too little content. You do stuff that’s really simple and really repetitive, people can latch onto it at the moment, but over time, it’s not feeding you. We’re to let the word of Christ dwell in us richly. I think Psalm 111 says, “Great are the works of the Lord studied by all who delight in them.” Studied, that mean they’re unsearchable. So we have to spend some time expounding them, exploring them, trying to figure out what is so great about the Lord. That takes words. So if you just sing simple, easily accessible immediately singable songs, that’s all you do. Yeah. After a while people are gonna check out. And if they are singing, they’re not gonna be singing with much thought.
DZ: Yes.
BK: So yeah, too little content can be… We end up worshiping our worship really is what happens. Praising our praise, being passionate about our passion. It’s like, “I don’t really know what I’m saying, but I love you Lord with all my heart.” It’s like we get so…
DZ: There he goes singing again.
BK: Excited about our love and our… And there are really very few examples in Scripture where people are simply moved by the fact that they’re moved. It is all based on the objective realities of who God is, what he said and what he’s done. His worthiness, his word and his works, that’s what we are singing about. That’s what moves us. And yet there are times when we wanna respond with, “Hey, this is moving to me. Lord, I do love you.” So there’s that balance.
DZ: Yeah. I think just something to briefly add, I think your congregation coming in on Sunday mornings is hungry. And you have to know that as a worship leader. They’re hungry to be fed like lambs wanting to come and we have a great shepherd who’s given us what will indwell us and feed us and…
BK: Himself.
DZ: Change us, is himself. And so you gotta know that when you’re planning songs and singing songs, yeah your people want to be fed.
BK: Yes. Yes. Yeah. And I would issue this challenge to those who are, “Oh my church won’t sing wordy songs, they just want to sing what’s popular.” It’s going to take time and we should do a podcast on leading your church through change. I don’t think we’ve done one, that would…
DZ: Yeah, I don’t know.
BK: I think that might be helpful. But it’s worth doing, it’s worth pursuing just for the reason you said, God wants to give us himself in Christ by the power of his Spirit, he does that through his word. And so it’s worth helping your church appreciate words that might be beyond those that would be immediately accessible.
DZ: Yeah.
BK: And ones that might cause them to think more deeply about who the Lord is and what he has done.
DZ: Excellent, point number six.
BK: Familiarity. Kind of related to a little content, but if you have not changed your repertoire in the last three years, it’s likely that people might be singing, but they’re more likely just mouthing the words. We just become overly familiar with things, and again, people begin to check out, our minds don’t have to work, we don’t have to wonder, what does this really mean? And so it just becomes overly familiar, this is anything, that can happen with anything.
DZ: Yeah.
BK: Switch the list to number seven, which is kind of the opposite. Lack of repetition. So I remember years ago, I would seek to teach… We would seek to teach in our church two new songs every month, so about 24 songs a year. Well, we only sing about 100 songs a year, so that means every four years your entire repertoire is being replaced, [chuckle] which does not make for very good multigenerational singing, for honoring those who have gone before you, or helping our children grow up with songs that they can sing throughout their lives. So lack of repetition is to be avoided as well.
DZ: That’s really good because I would imagine there has to be a worship leader… I’ve been here myself when I’ve been leading in a congregation or in a setting where my Planning Center is 1400 songs.
BK: That’s a problem.
DZ: You know what I mean? And I think a lot of worship leaders feel that way of like, man, it’s like a closet of stuff I haven’t gone through and… Yeah, I think you’re missing out on the ability for them to know the songs they’re singing every Sunday.
BK: Yes.
DZ: That is… I’m just telling you, if you’re listening to this, being in a congregation that does that is so enriching, it’s so engaging, because I know this song, I don’t have to sit and study it every Sunday.
BK: Every Sunday, right. It’s okay first time you hear it, to be thinking, “Wow, why… What is this song saying? Oh, I’ve never thought about that.” And songs give us ways of saying things we wouldn’t think of ourselves.
DZ: Yeah.
BK: Not simply for creativity sake, but to more faithfully represent what God has said to us in his word. That’s what songs do, they do it in a fresh way, a creative way, it’s not new truth, it’s just a new way of expressing it. But it is a benefit, as you said, to be able to sing those words with deeper appreciation. I love what Harold Best said I think I’ve said this on the podcast before, but it’s in, Music through the eyes of Faith. He says, “Faith enables us to sing an old song in a fresh way, and a new song in a familiar way.” So the old song in a fresh way because it’s saying, it’s not just this song that I’m thinking of, it’s what it’s saying, these truths that it represents and that ignites a passion to my soul, it makes me want to sing this song again. So how many times have I sung? A newer song, “Yet Not I But Through Christ In Me”.
DZ: Yeah.
BK: Our friends at CityAlight it just… It’s moving to me every time, and even as it becomes more familiar, I am aware of how much it says, so it’s a familiar song, but I can sing it in a fresh way.
DZ: And it says a lot.
BK: It does say a lot.
DZ: It has four verses. Yeah. And they’re packed.
BK: Yes, they’re packed.
DZ: So it isn’t a song that you would do every Sunday…
BK: Well, yeah, I wouldn’t. I could. I could do it every Sunday.
DZ: But it is a song that once you get it, that’s another really fast point, that song has so much repetition, it’s easy to pick up.
BK: Yes, to this I hold…
DZ: Yes. And so when you sing four verses, it doesn’t really feel like it’s changed, it’s not changing every time.
BK: Yes.
DZ: So even a song you can kind of get away with like that allows you to sing it multiple times but…
BK: We’re only half way through, we better move along, [chuckle] we’re probably going to have heart…
DZ: Probably.
BK: Okay, let’s see, what are we on? Lack of repetition. Number eight, congregation not believing they’re the main sound. We’ve talked, I think quite a bit about this on the podcast, but if your congregation doesn’t believe their voice really adds to the sound, what reason do they have to sing really? They don’t think they’re being heard. They don’t think they’re being noticed, that all the musicians have in ear monitors, they’re not even listening, there’s no congregation mic, that they’re listening to it’s just like…
DZ: Complete separation.
BK: Yeah, complete separation. So they don’t believe they’re the main sound, so why would they sing? So we’ve talked about ways of encouraging that, doing occasional acapella, to repeat a chorus, toning the instruments down some, not over-playing all those kinds of things. But just the congregation, when they don’t believe they’re the main sound, they’re not going to sing loud. And one of the ways you can see this, whether they believe they’re the main sound or not, is when you drop all the instruments out, does the sound increase, does it get louder? Because people are saying, “Yeah, finally we get to sing.” Or does it get softer because everyone thinks, “Oh, we’re not being supported by the band, and so I can’t sing. I don’t want anybody hear my voice.” No, we want people to sing with all their heart. Psalm 108, “My heart is steadfast, Oh God, my heart is steadfast, I will sing and make melody with all my being,” and that’s what we want our people to be doing.
DZ: Yes.
BK: So they have to believe they’re the main sound. Number nine, too many new songs. I think we talked about that, too many new songs. Yeah, just when you teach a new song, take time to keep introducing it, so that people get it. Number 10, too many harmonies. We just did a podcast on this.
DZ: We did.
BK: Not saying that harmonies are bad or if you sing harmonies that you’re, obviously performing, no, harmonies are great.
DZ: Yes.
BK: They’re just not to be assumed.
DZ: Yeah.
BK: And it’s not to be assumed that because I can sing harmony and that fits my voice better, that that means I should sing harmony because it’s about serving the congregation.
DZ: Right.
BK: So, if we’re always singing harmonies, it can be hard for the congregation to pick up, what the melody actually is.
DZ: Right. And the congregation is going to be singing harmonies along with…
BK: A lot of them will. Yeah.
DZ: Yeah, with what you’re doing. Yeah. And a lot of them won’t either. They will only sing the melody and they want to find it.
BK: Yeah.
DZ: So we just want to make it easier for them to find the melody.
BK: Yes. Absolutely.
DZ: Yeah.
BK: So we can all sing together.
DZ: But we did just talk about that. Yeah, on our podcast.
BK: Number 11, unclear leadership. I’ve both been under this and done it myself. [chuckle] Where you’re just not doing a good job telling people where to come in, where things end, when things slow down, when the song ends, like you’re just not giving them any indication, you’re just kind of letting them figure it out.
DZ: Yes.
BK: If you’re a leader, and you’re up there in front of the congregation in front of the church, lead, at the right moments, it’s like driving down a highway going somewhere, and you have to make a turn. You don’t need to say anything, while you’re just driving down the highway. But if there’s a turn, you say, “Hey, there’s a turn.” We don’t hang out of the turn, we just say, “Hey, here’s a turn, turn on this road.” There you go.
DZ: Right.
BK: Alright. And so that kind of leadership, when it’s lacking can leave a congregation very timid.
DZ: And second guessing.
BK: Yes.
DZ: When do I come in?
BK: Yes. Especially for smaller churches?
DZ: Yeah.
BK: So it’s even more important in smaller churches, that you never give the congregation this sense of, where are we?
DZ: Yeah.
BK: What are we doing? Where are we going? Just let them know. It’s not interrupting the flow. It’s not, banishing the Holy Spirit. It’s a way of really serving people, by letting them know. It might be as simple as… Just say, “In Christ Alone” after the introduction.
DZ: Yes.
BK: I just keep using that song. Someone said, “You always use ““n Christ Alone” as a model for, what you’re doing.” Well, it’s a great song.
DZ: It’s a great song.
BK: But whatever song it is.
DZ: Yeah.
BK: Just sing the first line of the verse and just… It just gives people faith to sing.
DZ: It does. And I think you’ve modeled this really well, Bob and…
BK: I’m trying Dave. I’m trying.
DZ: It’s been really helpful. I think even… I also know, as worship leaders, we can have a tendency to always say the first line of every verse, we’re about to sing.
BK: Which is unnecessary. Exactly.
DZ: But I think you’ve been helpful in saying, if it is, “what gift of grace is Jesus, my Redeemer”? You can say something that’s impactful. Briefly…
BK: Yes.
DZ: Before you… It doesn’t have to be the lyrics too.
BK: Yes.
DZ: It can be…
BK: Expound on them.
DZ: Let’s sing this in faith.
BK: Yes.
DZ: Or, yes. An opportunity, again, to shepherd and to help people.
BK: Yes, yes. This is our response.
DZ: Yep.
BK: That kind of thing. Alright. Number twelve, distractions. Oh, that could be what someone’s wearing. It could be…
[chuckle]
DZ: I love that you went there first.
[laughter]
BK: I guess, it could be…
DZ: If it’s fluorescent pink.
BK: What someone’s wearing. It could be an overactive fog machine or a fog machine at all. It could be…
DZ: Oh, my goodness.
BK: What other distractions, can you think of? I mean…
DZ: Oh, well, I mean, I think honestly, a lot of the distractions we’ve talked about in previous podcasts are overplaying. It’s way too loud. It’s more like a club than it is a gathering, a church gathering. Those can be the distractions that come to mind. I just, I love that you went to some of those funny ones.
BK: Yeah. [laughter]
DZ: Don’t be distracting.
BK: I mean, it is interesting how culture changes. It’s like what used to be distracting, isn’t distracting. I remember at one point, years ago, someone wearing like a baseball cap, would be distracting. Well, you’re not a worship leader, if you’re not wearing a baseball cap now.
DZ: That’s amazing.
BK: That’s not true.
[laughter]
BK: ‘Cause I’ve never worn a baseball cap, and never will. But yeah, culturally, it can change. So yeah, distractions, alright. Number 13, too effeminate. And I guess you could say, too masculine. Too effeminate, meaning that, we’re just about singing songs to Jesus, cause we love him, and He loves us. And some of, I mean, some of folks listening to this are in churches where the guys are just kind of, “I don’t know what you’re talking about.” That’s… I don’t, I have no idea like, how to even relate to what he’s saying.
DZ: How do I jump in and sing?
BK: Yeah, yeah.
DZ: Yeah.
BK: Oh, Jesus…
DZ: Wow. You have sang, so much on this podcast today, I’m so about it.
[laughter]
BK: So anyway. Or too masculine, your like, we’re the church.
DZ: Yeah. Sing right now.
BK: Yes. We’re the church and it’s all bold and, there’s that balance. I mean, think of Jesus. Jesus had no problem, like raking the Pharisees over the coals. He was bold, he was strong, but he could welcome little children. He had compassion on a prostitute. She found something in him, that didn’t condemn her, that was tender. And so it’s the Psalms again, show something similar.
DZ: Yes.
BK: That they can at times be very masculine, very feminine. But it’s the way of… It’s about who God is, how he relates to us. Sometimes he’s very tender, but we want to remember, he’s the God whose throne is his foundation… The foundation of his throne is righteousness, justice. I was just reading Psalm 97, this morning. Clouds and thick darkness are all around him. Righteousness and justice are the foundation of his throne. It’s like, whoa, so. So it’s that combination. Number 14, bad projection.
DZ: This is huge.
BK: Yeah, we probably should have started with this.
[chuckle]
DZ: We could have a whole podcast on this. It’s so huge.
BK: Maybe we should sometime.
DZ: I mean, it will be great.
BK: It’s a good idea.
DZ: Yeah, but just to highlight a couple points, I think… If… Your projection is just so important, do you know that.
BK: It is.
DZ: You’re the person that’s projecting lyrics.
BK: Yeah. Yeah.
DZ: If you do that in your church is so important.
BK: Yes.
DZ: And if…
BK: They should be there for rehearsals.
DZ: Yes. Yeah.
BK: Just to figure out what’s going on.
DZ: What else… Yeah.
BK: They should recognize that there might be a time lag between what they see on the screen and what’s on the screen.
DZ: Thank you for saying that.
BK: Well, I was at a conference a few years ago where they were using an intern. Not that this speaks of all interns.
[laughter]
BK: But it was an intern on the lyric projection. Every single slide. I don’t know what we should call them. Every single slide was late. I didn’t know a number of the songs. So talk about distractions, I just could not engage because they were all two lines and I missed the first half of it.
DZ: Yes.
BK: And it was like, Oh, please, please have mercy on me. A newcomer. I don’t know these songs. Please get me the lyrics before I sing them.
DZ: Yeah.
BK: I mean, we had people comment this on our… On our lyric videos. Ya know, can you get the lyrics up earlier, so we’ve sought to do that.
DZ: Yep.
BK: But you have to fade out, leave one line or one slide to get early to the next one.
DZ: Yes.
BK: It’s worth doing because it will hinder the engagement of your congregation.
DZ: Yeah.
BK: So they have to pay attention. They have to be alert. Yes they can worship the Lord. They might have their hand lifted, but you have your eye on that screen. [laughter]
DZ: Yes.
BK: You can do both and it’s about how well you’re serving in a non-distracting way. That’s what good projection is. People shouldn’t notice it.
DZ: And I would encourage… I would encourage worship leaders to not use a moving background.
BK: Oh. Why?
DZ: If possible, I think…
BK: You are so non-modern you are…
DZ: I think it can be like… I think it can be a little bit distracting. But I think what can be more distracting is having the… Filming the people doing what they’re doing and the lyrics are happening.
BK: Yes. Yes. That is the most distracting.
DZ: So.
BK: Why?
DZ: I think because when I’m just seeing text on a screen, I’m able to… There’s nothing else that’s taking my attention away…
BK: You’re just… You got the text. Nothing’s going to make it better.
DZ: Yeah.
BK: I remember watching videos or lyric projections where they would always show like the Maine coast. And I just always think of my two couple vacations we took in Maine and then I’d be lost. It was like, I’m not thinking about what I’m singing anymore. I was like, yeah, yeah, we did that. And we went to that city and… So, yeah, but that’s another side of things. Okay. Last number 15. Lack of conversion. Again, in many churches there are people who don’t know the word. They’ve been coming to church for years, years, and everybody assumes. Yeah. But you know that going to church does not make you a Christian, just like going to a garage doesn’t make you a car or going to McDonald’s doesn’t make you a hamburger. All those analogies [laughter]
DZ: Right.
BK: You have people who don’t know the Lord, their affections aren’t stirred, they don’t know why it’s so glorious. Their sins are forgiven that God has sent Jesus to live a perfect life they couldn’t live. That Jesus took their sins upon himself, endured their punishment, took the wrath of God in their place rose from the dead. And now they have new life in Christ and their eternity, eternal destiny has changed and their life is completely different because they’re in Christ. They don’t know that. And so why are they going to want to sing? We sing not because we have a great voice, not because we are professional singers. Not because someone tells us to, but because Jesus Christ has given us a song to sing. He’s the one who’s in our midst singing songs to the father and we are singing through him. How can we not sing?
DZ: Right.
BK: So we hope these reasons have given you encouragement, maybe something to work on, maybe something to be thankful for. If you have a singing congregation, praise God. May they continue to grow in the grace and knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ. And we trust that this has been helpful for you.
DZ: Amen. Yep.
BK: Thanks for joining us.
BK: Thank you for listening to Sound Plus Doctrine. The podcast of Sovereign Grace Music. Sovereign Grace Music exists to produce Christ exalting songs and training for local churches from local churches. For more information, free sheet music, translations and training resources. You can visit us at sovereigngracemusic.com.
